Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Talk about diets, exercise, and disease.
doglove
Bully Lover 4 Life
Posts: 1087
Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2009 8:39 am
Location: New Orleans

Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby doglove » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:39 pm

Radar is 9 weeks old today, and is fairly healthy despite having liquid poo. He's eating Cal. Naturals puppy forumla, and treats of the same formula. Two weeks ago the vet suggested giving him medication, but now they're refusing to even give me the name of it unless I bring him in for a health check, fecal, and shots. I'm all for vet visits, but not being pushed to spend money just for the name of a drug. I'll be finding another vet. I'm rather frustrated with that whole thing.

I have given my adult dogs pepto in the past, but I'm not sure about the dosage for a puppy. If anyone feels comfortable giving that info, please do. Anything that will help him pass a normal turd is worth trying.

My mother gave me a HUGE bag of venison for the dogs, after I'd been harassing them about having their hunting friends give me scraps. I expected bones, not chunks the size of a grown man's fist! I'm not complaining, but I'm also not sure how to feed it. There's no bone at all, just meat and some fat but not much. Any suggestions? I don't have any access to reasonably priced RMB to add to it. The cheapest I can find is $5 for a 7 inch section of leg bone.

On the subject of raw meat, does anyone have any good sources of information on the nutritional needs of puppies that is either easy to understand for a layperson or easy to research? I have yet to find any info, despite reading the BARF thread, lurking on raw feeding websites and forums, and emailing several people. I just never feel comfortable with the information given because it never get's specific. There's so much you can really mess up with raw diets, and with puppies it's very dangerous to starve them of nutrients.
I currently feed Shelby, my mal mix raw, but she's super easy - it's obvious when somethings wrong and I just played with it until she started acting normal again. She's really blossomed since then.

Adrianne's dog, Sloan, is his older sister and had issues with sensitive stomach and weight gain. She's suggested nutrical many times here on the forum. I'll be trying that, along with bone meal Proudymommy gave me the link to, but any other advice is helpful. I'm worried about him getting the right stuff to grow healthy and strong, and it makes me feel sick with worry when I see him having diarrhea.

Does anyone have an opinion on giving him puppy vitamins? Any suggestions on brands/type? What about joint supplements, can those be given to puppies? I'm not too worried about those at the moment, but it never hurts to arm yourself with knowledge.

He isn't the first pup I've raised, but he's the first I've owned since becoming a more knowledgable dog owner. I need to give him the best shot at a healthy adult life so we can be agility super stars!

User avatar
AllisonPitbullLvr
Moderator
Posts: 7006
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2010 10:21 am
Location: Onscario, Canada

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby AllisonPitbullLvr » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:45 pm

Your vet isn't being "annoying", they are protecting their licence to practice.

it would be illegal for them to give you advice over the phone regarding such an issue when diarrhea can be caused by so many things, especially in a puppy. It would be bad medicine for them to perscribe medications for a dog without doing some sort of rule-out first. A fecal check sounds perfectly reasonable to me.

With a good, balanced diet, your pup shouldn't need any supplements at that age. If you are going to be feeding raw, start by doing ALL your research before starting it.

doglove
Bully Lover 4 Life
Posts: 1087
Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2009 8:39 am
Location: New Orleans

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby doglove » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:56 pm

AllisonPibbleLvr wrote:Your vet isn't being "annoying", they are protecting their licence to practice.

it would be illegal for them to give you advice over the phone regarding such an issue when diarrhea can be caused by so many things, especially in a puppy. It would be bad medicine for them to perscribe medications for a dog without doing some sort of rule-out first. A fecal check sounds perfectly reasonable to me.

With a good, balanced diet, your pup shouldn't need any supplements at that age. If you are going to be feeding raw, start by doing ALL your research before starting it.



I really have no idea what you're talking about, or why you're even saying any of this about the vet office. No where in my post did I say that I asked them to write a prescription for a dog without seeing it, and no where in my post did I say that I asked them for medical advice over the phone. Please stop fabricating things and actually READ the post if you're going to reply. You're making me look like an idiot.

User avatar
AllisonPitbullLvr
Moderator
Posts: 7006
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2010 10:21 am
Location: Onscario, Canada

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby AllisonPitbullLvr » Wed Apr 20, 2011 2:03 pm

Holy defensive batman. Chill out.

I may have misunderstood your post, but I certainly didn't misread it.

Perhaps you should clarify then. HAS your puppy been seen? Had a fecal check? I am assuming that they have seen him two weeks ago (7 weeks...scary time for a pup to be having diarrhea) but a nine week old puppy without shots, parvo risk.

I'm not making you look like an idiot. I was clarifying your statments about your "annoying" vet.

User avatar
Shanda
Addicted to PBF
Posts: 5728
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2004 6:48 pm

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby Shanda » Wed Apr 20, 2011 2:07 pm

No offense, but Allison isn't the one making you look like anything. Her reply was quite reasonable in context, and contained sound advice.

User avatar
AllisonPitbullLvr
Moderator
Posts: 7006
Joined: Sun Apr 11, 2010 10:21 am
Location: Onscario, Canada

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby AllisonPitbullLvr » Wed Apr 20, 2011 2:08 pm

Read your other posts in the other thread. It would have been helpful in answering your questions to have some of those things written above.

Since your pup's fecal tested negative, what was the medication the vet suggested? Metronidazole? Tylocine? Some of these are better, safer options than giving human OTC meds.

Diarrhea in a 9 week old pup is worrysome because they can go downhill so fast.

I am sorry you had a bad experience with this vet but the point of my initial reply here was to show people that not all vets are "money-grubbers" and that they have their licences to protect. Your post made it sound like you called for advice, which they denied giving, which is a scenario that happens all too often. I would never want a vet to give me advice about my sick puppy over the phone without a full understanding of what was going on.

User avatar
highflyergirl19
Adolescent Bully
Posts: 378
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2011 6:48 pm

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby highflyergirl19 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 2:32 pm

I would certainly want my vet to look at my puppy before giving advice on how to treat him, even if they have already seen him once. It would actually worry me more if they didn't want to see my puppy before giving advice. It's one thing to describe things over the phone (or the internet), but it's another thing entirely to see it in person.

I would take the puppy to the vet and get him evaluated. A prescription specifically for canines will help a whole lot more than remedies made for humans. It may be extra cost, but I'm sure you would agree that his life is worth it. I've seen puppies go downhill in a matter of days when it comes to diarrhea.

User avatar
Misskiwi67
Addicted to PBF
Posts: 10498
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 9:37 pm
Location: Iowa City, IA

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby Misskiwi67 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:15 pm

Giving you the name of the medication so you can self-treat would be stupid, giving you the dosage information so you can purchase it yourself without seeing the pet first would be against the law.

Diarrhea in a 9 week old puppy requires testing for giardia, coccidia, hookworms, whipworms, bacterial overgrowth and parvo before treating. All but two of those problems require different medications, or different doses... so unless you want to waste a LOT of money on 4 different medications, then actually your vet is trying to save you money, and possibly save your dogs life by requiring you to see them before recommending treatment.

One of the most common medications for diarrhea that is available can cause seizures and death if overdosed... something that would be REALLY easy to do in a 9 week old puppy.

User avatar
Adrianne
Moderator
Posts: 10608
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:04 pm
Location: www.SmartyPaws.com
Contact:

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby Adrianne » Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:18 pm

I can only suggest what worked for Sloan.

As for Sloan we did fecals and even had a full blood panel pulled because I was worried and possibly over reacting because she is technically my boyfriends puppy and he'd left for Alaska for a few weeks and here I was with his puppy who refused to gain an ounce of weight. My vet was exceedingly nice and humored my panic but she assured me the pup had no traces of worms nor a virus nor a disorder that she could detect.

Her opinion was it was just a "puppy thing", possibly genetic, possibly due to bad water as baby. One thing my vet even said was maybe the change to Vegas water was irritating. It's also possible whatever she was eating as a pup with the breeder wasn't agreeing with her. It happens a lot according to what I understand and could be that some breeders still believe large breed puppy food will cause puppies to sprout like giants and be devastated with pano and joint issues.

Either way we finally got there. What I used was Blue Buffalo: large breed puppy kibble. I was a dedicated raw feeder and buying kibble was a hard step for me. lol Some boney meats, my vet prescribed more bone OR pumpkin to solidify the stool and decrease the irritation of the bowels and nutrical, which was my idea but my vet backed it, to fatten her up. My method may not work for all pups and not even pups from the same line or litter, but it worked for Sloan.

Evee, Sloan (and Radars) great aunt, whom belongs to my teammate on flyball had similar symptoms and she ended up having coccidia. So, I recommend still doing a fecal for safety sake.

Just do the vet check for safety sake, you'll feel much better after you do. After that start playing with the diet to find what works for you and Radar.

User avatar
Misskiwi67
Addicted to PBF
Posts: 10498
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 9:37 pm
Location: Iowa City, IA

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby Misskiwi67 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:20 pm

Also, pepto bismol contains salicylates, a medication similar to aspirin which can cause severe problems in dogs and can kill cats. It is not recommended for use in domestic animals of any kind except in rare cases where it is used as a combination therapy under the close supervision of a veterinarian.

User avatar
Adrianne
Moderator
Posts: 10608
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2006 10:04 pm
Location: www.SmartyPaws.com
Contact:

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby Adrianne » Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:30 pm

Misskiwi67 wrote:Also, pepto bismol contains salicylates, a medication similar to aspirin which can cause severe problems in dogs and can kill cats. It is not recommended for use in domestic animals of any kind except in rare cases where it is used as a combination therapy under the close supervision of a veterinarian.

Interesting, thank you, I've had it recommended in pill form twice. They were though rare cases, like you said.

User avatar
ProudMommy77
Forum Junky
Posts: 3766
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:46 am
Location: Sunny, PA
Contact:

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby ProudMommy77 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:33 pm

Feeding puppies RAW, requires three daily feedings, and generally it has to be ground, if you want more info you can PM me.

However, you said before you had a fecal done, and it came back negative. So, I suggested using some powder bone meal, and switching to a large breed formula. If you are feeding grain free, keep in mind that can have a effect. Stressors an also effect their bowels.

User avatar
Misskiwi67
Addicted to PBF
Posts: 10498
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 9:37 pm
Location: Iowa City, IA

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby Misskiwi67 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 3:36 pm

Adrianne wrote:
Misskiwi67 wrote:Also, pepto bismol contains salicylates, a medication similar to aspirin which can cause severe problems in dogs and can kill cats. It is not recommended for use in domestic animals of any kind except in rare cases where it is used as a combination therapy under the close supervision of a veterinarian.

Interesting, thank you, I've had it recommended in pill form twice. They were though rare cases, like you said.


It is still recommended by some old school vets... the formula of many OTC diarrhea meds have changed in recent years, and if you aren't on the up and up... you wouldn't know that. There aren't any human medications that don't contain salicylates anymore, at least not the last time I checked.

User avatar
ProudMommy77
Forum Junky
Posts: 3766
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:46 am
Location: Sunny, PA
Contact:

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby ProudMommy77 » Wed Apr 20, 2011 4:00 pm

doglove wrote:Does anyone have an opinion on giving him puppy vitamins? Any suggestions on brands/type? What about joint supplements, can those be given to puppies? I'm not too worried about those at the moment, but it never hurts to arm yourself with knowledge.


all of my puppies get CPN Structure, until six months of age. It's important that puppies, grow at a appropriate rate, not fast, (which is why I suggested the lg. breed formula also).

As far as raw goes, PM me and I can give you some advice, however when feeding prey model, all pieces should be larger than said puppy's head, to ensure proper chewing, and ripping. Unless you want to grind it up. Which I am just too darn lazy at this point to do it. lol.

As far as joint supplements, Glyoflex is good stuff, but also giving them their Omegas will help. But, really any Glucosamine and Chondroitin supplement will be fine.

Again, if you are looking for more advice feel free to PM me, this isn't my first time raising a dog for sporting, so I will gladly extend the invitation to you.

User avatar
starrlamia
Addicted to PBF
Posts: 7375
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:59 pm
Location: Canada

Re: Annoying vets, leaky puppy butt, and diet/raw feeding

Postby starrlamia » Wed Apr 20, 2011 6:04 pm

ProudMommy77 wrote:Feeding puppies RAW, requires three daily feedings, and generally it has to be ground, if you want more info you can PM me.

However, you said before you had a fecal done, and it came back negative. So, I suggested using some powder bone meal, and switching to a large breed formula. If you are feeding grain free, keep in mind that can have a effect. Stressors an also effect their bowels.

And arent you supposed to feed based on their adult weight and not current weight? They eat a lot more then big doggies! Im sure proudmommy can get you sorted out nicely on raw though!

Grendel had diarrhea at that age and negative fecals and other tests. We put him on some probiotics we got (purina brand I think) and it evened out after a while. Did you switch foods when you brought him home? I think that is what did it for grendel, so even thuogh he wasnt on the best food, we spent quite a few weeks very very slowly weaning him onto the new food. He still was gaining weight though and acting like a normal puppy.


Return to “Health Issues”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests