Raw food newbie has some annoying questions

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Raw food newbie has some annoying questions

Postby Steph-n-Wolf » Wed Sep 08, 2004 2:19 am

I am now feeding raw... we have "passed" the change-of-diet poos (sorry for the bad pun) and all is fairly well... A few questions, though. How much should I be feeding a day for my two VERY active young dogs?

What is a healthy ratio of muscle meat, innerds, fat, ground meat, bone, egg, egg shell, etc... (this is the consistant ingrediants) We raise organic eggs, so they are very available.

Should I add anythng else, like veggies?

I am assuming that natural fiber from hair and feathers is best as far as fiber/carb counts go, and the amount I have available of that is small (I don't think that they need much, though)

I have been adding a tea spoon of EV Olive oil...

I used to make raw/meaty mixes for ferrets that included goats milk, butter milk, and yogurt , but since I have actual animal fat to feed my pups, is it safe/smart to add more fat to the diet?

Is it possible to offer TOO many bones if they are all being eaten and enjoyed? (They are getting these after the meat mixes, so it has not seemed to take away from actual feedings)

My dogs love toung meat... anything wrong with leting them eat a cow toung every day or so? I mean, they LOVE it! Is liver safe for regular feedings, or should I limit it? Can I give too much of, lets say, beef lung, and somehow hurt my pup's health? (I suppose that would be part of my ratio question!)

Is there anything else that you raw feeders feed or put into mixes and soups that your dogs enjoy and offers good nutrition? I am not too hip on adding grain as I do not think that it is part of a dog's diet in the best of situations. I am willing to be shown differently if anyone has experience or info that they want to shar with me.

I am feeding beef, lamb, turkey, chicken, and sometimes elk, emu, or rabbit. Any suggestions are completely welcomed! I apologize if my questions have been answered in prior posts... feel free to give me a link if that is the case!

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Postby HugABull1 » Wed Sep 08, 2004 12:08 pm

Good for you going raw! (or rather, good for your doggies :)) )

I'll answer your questions to the best of my abilities. I'm by no means an expert, but I have been feeding my three raw for over a year and they're all healthy and happy :)

Feeding amounts - you should feed your adult dog around 2% of it's ideal bodyweight per day, you may need to feed a bit more for a very active dog, or a bit less for a lazy pupper. Puppies eat up to 10% of their body weight. Watch your dog's waistline (check ribs, waist, and neck), and adjust amounts accordingly.

Ratios - Everything I've read says 60% RMB, 20% meat, offal and fish, and 20% veggies (and grain if you feed grain - I don't). I find that's not enough meat or bone for my dogs. I feed about 70% RMB, 20% meat, offal, and fish, and 10% veggies. I used to be really anal and measure everything out. Now I just give them bones a few days in a row, and then feed them mash (veggies and meat or whatever) for a day or two. They get offal or fish whenever I think of it.

You can feed too much offal (liver, heart, etc.), as it's very rich and high in minerals. It's not recommended to feed offal more than once per week.

Egg shells are really high in calcium, and are a bone alternative. I don't feed them that often, as I feed bone daily and don't want to bugger up the calcium/phosphorus ratio. However, if you're giving them an egg, it should be fine to just give them the shell too. Just watch your dog doesn't get too constipated.

I would definitely add veggies, but this is debateable. Some people insist dogs are strict carnivores and don't need vegetables. I think they do need them, but again I'm not an expert. Wolves and wild dogs are eating wild game which has eaten a balanced, varied diet, and contains all sorts of vitamins and minerals. My dogs are eating domestic meat, which has been raised on hay and grain, and certainly isn't as nutritionally complete as wild game. So I feed mine veggies. Plus, the fiber's good. I do not feed grains however, it's not needed IMO, and Gage is allergic to all grains. Plus grains = farts :yucky:

I add plain yogurt for the bacteria in it, plus it's tasty and makes it easier to mix things together into a texture that is easily gobbled up rather than flicked all over the kitchen from a doggy tongue :thumbsup: I also add olive oil to my dog's food now and then. I wouldn't worry about the fat from yogurt, you're only adding a couple tablespoons a day, and the amount of fat in that is pretty small. I wouldn't bother with other types of dairy.

I'd be careful how much animal fat you're adding. Too much fat is bad for the pancreas. I just feed the fat that's already in the meat or in the skin that comes with that cut, and add a little here and there if they're coats are looking dry.

Tongue is a muscle, so should be fine.

You CAN feed too many bones if they're actually consuming them - they'll get fat lol. Try giving them femurs as recreational bones - most dogs can't eat right through those (although Angel does sometimes). A good, strong knuckle bone will usually last a while as well.

The other things I add are apple cider vinegar, kelp, fish oil, ginger, and cayenne pepper. Apple cider vinegar contains 19 of 22 trace elements in exactly the right amount, kelp is rich in minerals, fish oil is good for skin, coat, and other stuff (I forget lol), ginger is good for digestion, and cayenne is good for something too, I think maybe the immune system? Cayenne and apple cider vinegar both help speed up the metabolism and promote weight loss (they're in every diet pill out there). I feed my dogs regular ground beef as a meat source, which is high in fat, but they don't have any problems with pancreatitis or anything, largely I think because of the apple cider vinegar. My dogs are VERY lean, and never have any fat on them, just muscle.

I think I answered all your questions :))

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Postby barbponys » Wed Sep 08, 2004 12:11 pm

Hey Steph,
It sounds like you are doing real well so far. As far as veggies go, I use greens mixed with some harder veggies like broccoli, sweet potato, radish, peppers, turnip.........the only veggie so far they won't touch is rudabega. I add blueberries, orange, pineapple, any acidic fruit to the mix. Not a lot just enough to make sure the ph isn't too high. They also get those as treats, they love pineapple.

Organ meat:
Mine get it regularly, twice a week usually. I give liver, heart, tongue, kidney(chicken), spleen(once in a while). I rely on the raw meaty bones for calcium and other minerals, I don't use egg shells. My dogs will get into the eggs I get from the chickens(read.. forgot I laid them down somewhere) and they rarely eat the shells.

As far as ratios go, they don't get veggies everyday just a few times a week. If you want to do a ground mixture of muscle meat, organ meat, and veggies I would do a 80% muscle, 15% organ and 5% veggies. Adding the raw bones as treats or regular chews or as a meal replacement works well. Whether or not to add fat will depend on the dog. If it's too lean or having skin issues fat would be appropriate to add. Yogurt is good to add as long as it isn't high sugar or flavored. I don't believe in the feeding of dogs grain with a raw diet. They don't need it and can't digest them. It's wasted filler, why bother. A couple of times a week I add an egg or two to my dogs breakfast......occassionally they get 3 or 4 eggs for breakfast. Not very filling but packed with nutrition.

My dogs have bones available all the time. I personally don't think there's such a thing as too much bone, as long as they are raw it's good for them to be able to chew as they want.


Postby JessaNGizmo » Wed Sep 08, 2004 3:37 pm

Here on the Health Issue Forum I posted a thing about RAW Websites and it has alot so go check it out! I REALLY plan on going this route now since I work at WALMART! LOL 10% Discount baby!!

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