Whats wrong with Iams?

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Whats wrong with Iams?

Postby SpudsBud » Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:27 pm

I was talking to another dog owner about foods today and I asked why the store we were in doesn't carry Iams. He just said "Iams his horrible, look it up."

Well I figured I'll just ask here. Are Iams foods bad? My cats eat it and they're in great shape.
I heard that Iams got into some trouble for the way they treated the animals used in their studies? Something about debarking dogs. What else?
Have pets gotten sick from eating Iams? Is it a bad food or just an immoral company?

Spud gets Canidae...but that stuff is freakin expensive...
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Postby damienApbt » Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:44 pm

well, there are many reasons that iams is bad. one is the way they treat the animals they use to test their food. there are many documented accounts of animal abuse and neglect in their facilities.

but all that aside the food itself is hardly food at all. the bag is filled with stuff that are cheap and useless for the dog. only so they can mass produce it and still sell it for less. you have to look at the list of ingredients. in the long run, its not good at all for your dog.
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Postby SpudsBud » Sun Oct 03, 2004 12:48 pm

Could you tell me some of the useless ingredients in pet food? I know corn is one...

So I should stick with Canidae...I hate to sound so cheap but its $45 for a 20lb (!!) bag in the one and only store that sells it in my city. What are some other good brands?
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Postby damienApbt » Sun Oct 03, 2004 1:03 pm

wellness is good and for a 15 lb bag it goes for around $20.

you're right. corn is useless. its just so cheap and edible that they can fill a bag with it.

check this website out.

http://www.doberdogs.com/menu.html
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Postby tjbsandy » Sun Oct 03, 2004 1:07 pm

Hop over to the Haelth section and read the "Can't find a good diet?" sticky. There's a list there. :)

Also, check around for prices in you area. The Canidae is less expensive for me, yet Wellness, Innova, even Solid Gold are really high here. Judging by the post about how much we spend a month on dog food, the prices are widely varied from area to area.

I too am switching from IAMS. I can already see a difference in her fur. She seems to like eating better these days too! Once you've done some research and chosen your food, please don't worry so much about the cost. I balked at first too, and it was dumb luck that I chose the one food I could get for a bit less $ than the others. But it's worth the extra cash. If I can see the difference in her coat already, when she's not even completely transitioned, just imagine how much better it will be in the long run. Better food = less vet visits = less medical expense = a good trade off! And you don't have to feed so much of a better food, so it might just balance out cost wise.

The way I see it, I can survive on Ramen noodles for a while when things get tight. I've got a longer life to fix what I screw up! She only has a little while to be here in comparison, and I want to make that last as long as I can!

Happy researching!
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Postby duckzilla » Sun Oct 03, 2004 1:11 pm

Iams is crap. I had 3 cats on Iams for a period of time, they free fed, and were huge fat beasts. Lazy, loss of energy. I moved out, my roommate kept the cats, and I found that one of them died at only 4 years. I won't feed my dog anything that killed a cat after 4 years. I told my old roomie to switch the foods a LONG time ago. He wouldn't have it. So whatever.

I use Wellness, like Damien Recommended. I have seen great results from my pooch. She loves the taste and actually chews the kibbles (or whatever those pyramid shaped bits of food might be called) instead of inhaling like she did with the Bil-Jac (I switched her recently to get away from BHA in the Bil-Jac). The smell reminds me a bit of fresh cut alfalfa.. But I think thats the fruit mixed up in there.
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Postby barbponys » Sun Oct 03, 2004 6:18 pm

I've pasted the ingredients for Iams Chunks below. It reads like a nightmare. The first ingredient is chicken, raw chicken. It's heaviest by weight before they cook it but then it's, in reality, the 6th or 7th ingredient by weight after it looses all the water. So, you are feeding a corn based food. You have 2 grain sources as your main protein before you get to the chicken BY-PRODUCT meal. That means all the crap that isn't meat is added to the food. So, now you have no meat based protein in the first 6 ingredients. Add to that the NATURAL chicken flavor, I shudder to think what THAT could be. Beet pulp for nice dry, hard stools, followed by 27 additives. Notice the DL-Methionine.....they NEED that in there to keep your dogs ph low enough to prevent struvite crystals, or try to anyway. :yucky: It's a crap food that will cost you a hell of a lot more in the long run than forking out a few more bucks for higher quality foods.



Chicken, Corn Meal, Ground Whole Grain Sorghum, Chicken By-Product Meal, Ground Whole Grain Barley, Chicken Fat (preserved with Mixed Tocopherols, a source of Vitamin E, and Citric Acid), Fish Meal (source of fish oil), Chicken Meal, Dried Beet Pulp (sugar removed), Natural Chicken Flavor, Dried Egg Product, Brewers Dried Yeast, Potassium Chloride, Salt, Sodium Hexametaphosphate, Flax Meal, Choline Chloride, Calcium Carbonate, Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Oxide, Vitamin E Supplement, DL-Methionine, Ascorbic Acid, Manganese Sulfate, Copper Sulfate, Manganous Oxide, Vitamin A Acetate, Calcium Pantothenate, Biotin, Rosemary Extract, Thiamine Mononitrate (source of vitamin B1), Vitamin B12 Supplement, Niacin, Riboflavin Supplement (source of vitamin B2), Inositol, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (source of vitamin B6), Vitamin D3 Supplement, Potassium Iodide, Folic Acid, Cobalt Carbonate
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Postby duckzilla » Sun Oct 03, 2004 6:41 pm

Not that I am being a nay-sayer.. but what differences do you see from the Iams ingredients vs the following we'll call this brand B for now:

Deboned Chicken, Ground Barley, Oatmeal, Rye Flour, Menhaden Fishmeal, Whitefish, Ground Brown Rice, Ground Millet, Canola Oil (preserved with Rosemary, Vitamin C & E), Flax Seed, Amaranth, Dried Peas, Dried Carrots, Whole Sweet Potatoes, Whole Apples, Whole Blueberries, Whole Clove Garlic, Alfalfa Leaf, Yucca Schidigera, Probiotics (Lactobacillus Plantarum, Enterococcus Faecium, Lactobacillus Casei, Lactobacillus Acidophilus), Prebiotics (Inulin, Fructose), Glucosamine, Chondroitin Sulfate, Beta-Carotene, Potassium Chloride, Zinc Proteinate (a chelated source of Zinc), Ferrous Sulfate, Zinc Sulfate, Vitamin E Supplement, Copper Proteinate (a chelated source of Copper), Copper Sulfate, Niacin Supplement, Manganese Sulfate, Manganese Proteinate ( a chelated source of Manganese), Sodium Selenite, d-Calcium Pantothenate, Vitamin A Acetate, Riboflavin Supplement, Calcium Iodate, Vitamin B-12 Supplement, Vitamin D-3 Supplement, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamine Mononitrate, Folic Acid.
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Postby PitBullPride » Sun Oct 03, 2004 6:42 pm

Sulfate and copper..... :yucky:
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Postby Odnarb » Sun Oct 03, 2004 7:23 pm

barbponys wrote:Notice the DL-Methionine.....they NEED that in there to keep your dogs ph low enough to prevent struvite crystals, or try to anyway.



Interesting, I've never noticed the DL-Methionine in an ingredients list before, is this a common ingredient?

What I find fascinatiing, is the fact that I think we are seeing more and more calcium oxilate crystals/stones. I'll bet they are over-correcting in many cases.

My thoery, anyway.
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Postby elegy » Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:09 pm

barbponys wrote:Notice the DL-Methionine.....they NEED that in there to keep your dogs ph low enough to prevent struvite crystals, or try to anyway. :yucky:


heh. my canidae-eatin dog has sterile struvites right now. whee. vet says it is the diet she's on blah blah blah. not quite sure what to do with her at this point. she's on waltham's SO to see if they'll dissolve. assuming they do, there's no way i'm keeping her on prescription food for life.
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Postby Hosh » Sun Oct 03, 2004 9:12 pm

LMFAO you know what is so funny, tonight in the grocery store i was looking at the Canidae dog food and a lady jus strolls her cart past me...stops then backs up and goes..."oh you know this is the BEST food you can feed your pets...they love it and plus it helps your skin" so i lookd down in her cart where she was pointing and there was a huge bag of Iam's....I just thanks her and kinda laughed when she walkd away because erlier today i was reading this topic...thanks!
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Postby damienApbt » Sun Oct 03, 2004 10:00 pm

ha...duckzilla is that wellness?? sounds familiar. i've been reading labels like its my job lately.

i know most people prefer whole oats.. if any at all. oatmeal as i've learned is almost pure gluten..rather than oats. gluten is a binding agent used in doughs and such..not too befeficial for dogs. wellness has a large amount of starch and grains. starches are hard for dogs to digest and large amounts or varieties of grains could be tough on dogs because of some common grain allergies. a lot of hight quality foods like to keep the grains to a minimum.

other than that it reads really well. definitely better than most. the thing i've noticed about wellness is that they do have some fillers but nothing too bad. mostly just to keep their prices affordable. i do like wellness.. i feed it myself. i like it because they make it affordable and available but still maintain a certain level of quality that is above all other common store bought names. i have great results with wellness but i know there is better out there, only i cant quite afford them yet.

i am still new at this so i could be wrong about some of it. just taking a shot at it. and also i've only been able to study the importants of the 1st ten or so ingredients. all the other stuff is still greek to me but im still learning.
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Postby barbponys » Sun Oct 03, 2004 10:57 pm

Good job Damien. Keep at it. You'll be an expert in no time.

I recognize that as Wellness. It performs relatively well. Beats the crap out of any grocery store food, and all the recognizable "premium" brands.

Odnarb,
I believe they are over correcting, and the other thing is....... prescription diets aren't meant to be fed forever. The longer you feed them the more chances of oxilate being the result. It's becoming more common for cat food to have the DL-Methionine in it for the simple fact cat's have such a hard time with grain. They seem to be doing that to cover their butts, they have learned the hard way that grains are a bad thing so...........even real good quality foods do it. Not for dog foods so much....I was kinda surprised to see it but it does make sense. It's becoming more of a common issue with dogs.
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Postby duckzilla » Mon Oct 04, 2004 9:45 am

aw shuckz no pulling the wool overn' yourn' eyes!

WELL NOT REALLY.. I wasn't TRYING to pull any fast ones. Mostly just by comparison, ingredient lables appear similar, but do merit further investigation. Just as Iams first ingredient is Chicken and likewise Wellness, they also conclude similarly with added vitamins and minerals... But it is HOW they are prepared that is the biggest factor. I do believe we may have forgotten to mention in either this post or the other thread containing an abundance of info on this topic.

Hooray for Wellness and the studious abilities to pick that RIGHT out of the hat you smarties! :headbang:
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