neuter early, dog size

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BrentS
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neuter early, dog size

Postby BrentS » Wed Dec 05, 2007 12:12 pm

I had my APBT neutered around 5 months if I remeber right. I read some where that if you neuter a male before 1 1/2 years and a female before 1 year that the dog won't develope to it's full size and structure (Not just APBT breeders). It's mainly breeders that say this, and I have yet to hear it from a vet. I'm just wondering what thoughts are out there on this. Thank you!

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dr961
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Postby dr961 » Wed Dec 05, 2007 12:55 pm

I read some where that if you neuter a male before 1 1/2 years and a female before 1 year that the dog won't develope to it's full size and structure


Spaying and castrating before sexual maturity will delay the closing of the growth plates in long bones, which often causes dogs to grow somewhat taller than they normally would. Being taller can sometimes make those dogs more lanky looking than they might otherwise have been.

I'm not a vet, just a longtime dog person, but it isn't really disputable that castrating a male animal before maturity will diminish some secondary sex characteristics that develop at maturity in males: just look at the difference between a bull and a steer (a male castrated young). In dogs, sex differences aren't as pronounced as in some other animals, but they do exist, so it's possible that a male dog neutered early (before 6 months old) won't develop the same physique as he might have if left intact. But it isn't really a huge difference, and breed genetics determine most of how a dog will look, regardless of its testosterone or lack thereof. Female dogs spayed early can also grow taller, but don't generally become more masculine in looks.

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Deniselynn
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Postby Deniselynn » Wed Dec 05, 2007 1:15 pm

[color=blue][There are quite a few threads pertaining to the question you asked. Here is one that has a lot of useful information:[
http://www.pitbullforum.com/viewtopic.p ... ering+size
/color]

jiggy

Postby jiggy » Wed Dec 05, 2007 1:42 pm

nuetering early deprives the dog of testosterone they need to grow properly.
youre basically stopping them from ever going through the growth spurt they hit during puberty. not just physically but mentally as well.

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Postby KadillacGrrl » Wed Dec 05, 2007 1:47 pm

Personally, I will wait until a male is about a year old before I'll neuter him.

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makedonce78
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Postby makedonce78 » Wed Dec 05, 2007 5:52 pm

wow.....


I specifically asked my vet if neutering Vuk at 5 months would effect his growth and they said no. Now that he is back from the surgery (just yesterday), I feel bad that I did it that soon.



Why do you guys prefer a male to be 1 year old before neutering (except for that growing taller and stuff)?

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BrentS
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Postby BrentS » Wed Dec 05, 2007 7:22 pm

I wanted to neuter my male APBT fairly quickly because I didn't want a intact APBT around. I felt it made me a good owner, lessoned chance of puppies, and less chance of him being DA. But, I feel I didn't let him fill out as much as he could, he doesn't have much muscle tone for a APBT even though I walk him a lot. That doesn't matter much to me, but I was curious if the neutering thing made a difference.

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Postby Carla » Wed Dec 05, 2007 7:54 pm

BrentS wrote:I wanted to neuter my male APBT fairly quickly because I didn't want a intact APBT around. I felt it made me a good owner, lessoned chance of puppies, and less chance of him being DA. But, I feel I didn't let him fill out as much as he could, he doesn't have much muscle tone for a APBT even though I walk him a lot. That doesn't matter much to me, but I was curious if the neutering thing made a difference.


I personally have a problem with the push to neuter so eary.

Common sense it seems would tell you that the SEX hormones are going to affect growth and secondary SEX characteristics. I believe it's almost a form of cruelty to deprive a dog of being able to mature -- mentally and physically -- before it is neutered. To me, it's just not right to take away such critical substances that affect every process in the body.

I KNOW why it's pushed buy I wish people had a little more dog sense -- or something -- that would allow them to deal with an intact dog for a year anyway....

I mean, it's a DOG! Let him grow to BE a dog!

Carla

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Postby Deniselynn » Wed Dec 05, 2007 8:36 pm

If I had to do it all over again, I would not have neutered Logan when I did (he was neutered at 5 /12 months). I feel like I totally robbed him of his full potential growth wise. Granted, he is muscular and in great shape but I know if I would have kept him intact until he was a year old, there would have been a difference.

Here I thought I was doing the right thing. :frown:

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Postby Lizzie » Wed Dec 05, 2007 8:42 pm

jiggy wrote:nuetering early deprives the dog of testosterone they need to grow properly.
youre basically stopping them from ever going through the growth spurt they hit during puberty. not just physically but mentally as well.


Actually, it's been explained to us by several surgeons that it is quite the opposite...neutering early can result in a taller, lankier dog.

The release of testosterone (and this is my non-medically-educated paraphrasing here) triggers the closing of the growth plates and the growth of muscles. By neutering early (we did JJ at 4 months) the testosterone is cut off before it is ever released. Thus we ended up with a taller dog than we would have if we had waited, because his growth plates would have actually closed sooner if testosterone had been allowed into his system.

We're never neutering before 1 year again. I'm not saying JJ's horrible hip problems are because of his early neuter...but I'm not saying they're not either. :(

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Postby Lizzie » Wed Dec 05, 2007 8:44 pm

PS - when I say that neutering early can result in a bigger dog, I am strictly referring to them being taller, not wider. They can actually be lankier and less muscular when they're neutered early.

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Postby granitebull » Wed Dec 05, 2007 9:44 pm

Just before we got our puppy I read a lot about neutering before maturity. One of the best articles is this one : http://www.tiarapoodles.com/neutering.html

We had a bullmastiff that was neutered at 6 mths and all skeletal/muscular development problems that the article talks about he had unfortunately. We did not know it then but now reading about it it is quite obvious. So we talked to our puppy's breeder and agreed (in the puppy contract) that we will neuter him before age 2.

I will never again have a dog neutered before maturity even though it is less of an issue with medium sized dogs.

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Postby dr961 » Wed Dec 05, 2007 10:31 pm

I must say I'm pleasantly surprised that so many people are waking up to the fact that castrating dogs before maturity is not a good thing for the health of dogs. It seems that misguided political correctness over-ruled common sense way too often, and unless everyone got their male dogs castrated as soon as possible, they'd be screamed at for contributing to dog overpopulation--like a properly cared for male dog would be running the neighborhood, or that he would somehow escape and get lucky, finding a female in just the right stage of heat.

There is no medical reason to castrate dogs, IMO. Removing testicles of course eliminates testicular cancer (a rare thing in dogs), but it doesn't eliminate prostate trouble in old age. If owners want to tone down very dominant or over-sexed males, they can always neuter as soon as such problems appear, often at around a year or two old.

I'm all for spaying females, as they are the ones that have pups. But even then, if owners are responsible, waiting until after the first season isn't the end of the world. Plus, all the hassle and mess of a bitch in season, and sometimes false pregnancies after, hopefully will convince owners to spay. In my experience, spaying does nothing to tone down aggressive females, unlike castrating males. Many spayed bitches I've had actually marked territory like stud dogs!

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makedonce78
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Postby makedonce78 » Thu Dec 06, 2007 7:51 am

wow....now I feel bad that I did this to my pup. Never again will I neuter a dog before they fully develop. Thanks guys for opening our eyes :thumbsup:

msvette2u

Postby msvette2u » Thu Dec 06, 2007 9:08 am

Well I guess I have a different view of it all, as rescuers, we DO alter as early as 8 weeks/2lbs. and have not had problems with it.
We'd rather do that, then take a chance that one of our dogs could cause an accidental litter.
It is my belief that truly responsible owners are few and far between.
It's not neutered animals we see in shelters, or roaming the roads, or dead on the road, it's the unaltered ones. The drive to breed is pretty strong ;)


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