The Truth About Compulsion Training

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smarmysmile

The Truth About Compulsion Training

Postby smarmysmile » Mon Feb 02, 2009 4:05 am

Taken from youtube:

"Jon Naroditsky of Fala Woods K9 Training and Developmental Center kennel link removed is starting a series of clips showing the correct use of compulsion and its effectiveness on various dogs from young puppies to problematic adult dogs of various stages--forward aggression or fear based.

This clip is of a family owned 3 year old intact male GSD with active, forward fear based aggression. The owners are attentive and concerned with a well mannered son. The problem stemmed from permitting the behaviors due to lack of knowledge on how to handle this dog. not neglect or abuse.

Fala Woods does not perceive compulsion as harsh physical corrections. Instead compulsion is teaching a dog to take responsibility for its actions and accept a physical leash correction from the handler. Leash corrections are only given as a consequence for non-compliance once the dog understands what is being asked of it. A leash is also used as a physical guide along with your hands to manipulate the body into the various positions desired."



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Amie
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Re: The Truth About Compulsion Training

Postby Amie » Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:08 am

smarmysmile wrote:compulsion is teaching a dog to take responsibility for its actions


:huh?:

msvette2u

Postby msvette2u » Mon Feb 02, 2009 10:12 am

This whole thing is :huh?: to me.

smarmysmile

Postby smarmysmile » Mon Feb 02, 2009 10:14 am

Why the :huh?:?

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retro
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Postby retro » Mon Feb 02, 2009 12:41 pm

smarmysmile wrote:Why the :huh?:?



makes perfect sense to me.

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Postby MikeZev » Mon Feb 02, 2009 1:42 pm

I dont get it, wheres his clicker??

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Postby Stormi » Mon Feb 02, 2009 1:49 pm

Phsyically correcting a dog for fear based aggression. Wow, how brilliant.

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Amie
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Postby Amie » Mon Feb 02, 2009 1:52 pm

smarmysmile wrote:Why the :huh?:?


Weren't you the one claiming in another thread that dogs aren't really shy or happy, those are human things we project onto them?

And here you are saying the "truth" about compulsion training involves the dog taking responsibility for his or her actions?

Seriously?

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Red
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Postby Red » Mon Feb 02, 2009 2:04 pm

And here you are saying the "truth" about compulsion training involves the dog taking responsibility for his or her actions?

Seriously?


That seems to be excuse used by those who are not able to train their dogs reliably with more appropriate methods.Giving responsibility to an animal take away the human beings responsibility for understanding behaviors and what drive them.

Aversion used for fear based aggression...plain ignorance.

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Postby 1lila1 » Mon Feb 02, 2009 3:38 pm

Watching those videos was like deja vu with all the trainers I've been to with Lila over the years. It's so scary exactly how many of them use old antiquated techniques like this and they are messing up so many dogs. Esp. the breeds like Pit Bulls, Shepherds, Presas, etc. Trainers and owners excuse aggressive behavior or attribute it to other reasons or causes that they'd never attribute the same things to if the behavior was shown by a poodle or Golden. Or they use harsh macho techniques on these dog breeds.

I took Lila to so many dog trainers and only LAST YEAR is when I found out her aggression was based in anxiety and fear. And even the first trainer who told me that STILL was going to use an alpha roll on Lila when she showed aggression to other dogs. He literally told me that five minutes after he told me she was showing fear aggression. WTH?

Honestly, it wasn't' until I met with Red that I actually received useful information. As well as book recommendations that have helped incredibly. Don't other dog trainers read the latest books and keep up with new knowledge and behavioral findings? It baffles me! If I as a layperson can go order a book on Amazon why can't they?? It's very sad!

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Postby Inaras mom » Mon Feb 02, 2009 4:03 pm

Bruno would have been perfectly entitled to bite that fruitcake. He was giving hundreds of small nagging corrections; he would correct before even giving a command; he corrected after the command was performed (Bruno was down and he was still correcting...?); and he was saying "good boy" while he corrected. Way to screw up a dog.

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Postby Emma H » Mon Feb 02, 2009 8:06 pm

That video was a perfect example of why I do not use compulsion training. All I saw was a stressed out, very confused dog that just wanted it all to end. He very clearly was not learning that people are okay.[/list]

smarmysmile

Postby smarmysmile » Mon Feb 02, 2009 8:41 pm

Amie wrote:Weren't you the one claiming in another thread that dogs aren't really shy or happy, those are human things we project onto them?


When did I claim that?

Amie wrote:And here you are saying the "truth" about compulsion training involves the dog taking responsibility for his or her actions?

Seriously?


Actually, John Naroditsky is one the one saying it, I just happen to agree...thus the thread. There's a lot of misinformation and context sniping going on around here when it comes to compulsion so I figured this thread would be helpful.

Some will get it, others will stick to what they know.

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Postby Mya&theSiebenDackels » Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:08 pm

I really did not want to watch all the videos but, what was the guy using to train the fear aggressive GSD??

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Postby Mya&theSiebenDackels » Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:19 pm

I watched the videos and the GSD just looks really scared. How does the training actually work for fear aggressive dogs??

That training would scare and make Buddy, our dachshund that has fear issues, fear pee everywhere. Also, Tank would not do good with that either. I will stick to positive training. :thumbsup:


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