B.A.R.F. 101

Talk about diets, exercise, and disease.
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starrlamia
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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby starrlamia » Mon Dec 13, 2010 5:56 pm

FransterDoo wrote:
starrlamia wrote:thanks! i hacked most of the meat off the back i have its mostly just fat now lol, i do have a few meals for them that are their whole day's worth like the drumsticks, it shouldnt be too much of an issue to feed them once a day a couple of times right?


shouldn't! You might want to hand out a couple of cookies or a slice of Nature's Balance roll during the missing meal and make sure that you have some amount of meat on those bones if they are prone to hard poops or bile pukes.

The cheapest way for us to buy green tripe is in the 5 pound logs. It means everyone gets super huge tripe meals. I just cut back by 1/2 the meals around it until we've evened out a bit.

awesome thanks!
I have to go home tonight and hack up 2 turkeys UGH!

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby El_EmDubya » Wed Dec 15, 2010 2:29 pm

You need to add more Omegas to that diet. Try 1gram Salmon Oil/10 lbs of dog per day, minimum. All OUR diets are severely lacking in Omegas, so that ratio goes for people too.

Green tripe can be found at greentripe.com.

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby FBODGRL » Wed Dec 15, 2010 7:41 pm

Can someone answer this for me :oops:

FBODGRL wrote:I know I asked this either here or in my thread, but now I have a more in depth question about fish.

Khan has eaten tilapia, cod and catfish. Just fillets. Not whole fish with head and skin.

I read on the raw feeding group on yahoo a post where someone was saying feeding tilapia is bad because it is mos likely farm fish and fed corn and something else. Plus it was no good for any Omega's.

So my question is....is this true? What type of fish should I feed? Salmon is a really not cost effective. I suppose I could feed it occasionally, but not on a regular basis. I thought any fish was ok.

I haven't done any beef since I started in the beginning, but I think I may pick some up next week.


couple more questions too.

Venison is considered a red meat, right? Not sure where I read they should eat more red meat, than white or if it even matters :dunno:

Also...I used salmon oil for the longest time, but when I ran out I got fish oil. I was doing the salmon oil for his allergies, so I thought changing would be fine. So is just regular fish oil still ok for omega's?

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby El_EmDubya » Wed Dec 15, 2010 8:43 pm

Yes, venison is red meat.

Depending upon your dog's nature (and your feeding philosophy), red meat may or may not be necessary. If you wish to feed only "fast twitch" animals (rabbit, chicken, rodent, smelt, sardine) vs "slow twitch" (cow, pig, large fish (grouper, not tuna)) to keep your dog lean, it is not necessary to feed ANY red meat. BUT, you must feed liver and other organs to have a balanced diet. Just feeding a certain cut of meat over and over will not provide the variety needed for a complete and balance diet.

Re the issue of Omegas: It is a long and politically charged topic. Here's a little "light" reading:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omega-3_fatty_acid
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/druginfo/natural/993.html

What IS known: animals eating a natural diet have more Omega 3s than those fed unnatural diets (for bovines natural would be grasses, for example, rather than corn and soy mixed pellets fed on feed lots). Therefore, if you are feeding meat that has been fed an "unnatural" diet, you will need to supplement with Omegas.

Now, regarding the term "fish oil"...You are going to have to investigate what the manufacturer means by "fish oil". Not all fishes are created equal. You can see from the Wiki page a list of Omega 3 concentrations for each type. Depending upon the average depth that they live, their bodies will have more or less Omega 3s. The deeper the water and the colder the water, the more omega 3s because they are more flexible and therefore remain liquid in lower temps than the longer chain Fatty Acids.

Some of the other things to consider is the length of the food chain:
Krill oil is the most green of the non plant producing Omega 3 sources, but it is very expensive.
As you move up the food chain, there is a greater likelihood of heavy metal contamination, which is bad.
But the FDA says the risk is worth the benefit, so that might be good. (Then again the FDA is a political machine, so you need to consider the source.)
You can always feed Flax or Hemp oils, although they will also have plant estrogens, which may be bad ...esp, for the boys.

Sigh. roflmao Is this helping?

I feed Grizzly Salmon Oil. It suits my budget and the fact that my dog is old, so we probably won't have to worry about heavy metal issues. In younger dogs, where brain development might be an issue, I'd choose to feed Krill over Salmon.

LMW

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby El_EmDubya » Thu Dec 16, 2010 11:27 am

If you are feeding veggies, they need to be steamed to break down the cellulous plant walls so your dog can get 'some' nutrition. I used to do the grind regime, but have since kept my boy's diet pretty simple as he has a very low stress life and has few health issues. It is up to you, but green tripe does a pretty good job of being a veggie grind, if you ask me.

LMW

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby starrlamia » Wed Dec 22, 2010 1:58 pm

been a week and half and things are going well, a few loose stools but I just upped their bone intake next meal and it seemed to even out. No vomiting or anything.

How long should I wait to add organ meat in?

I get a ton of pork today too yay! (im not looking forward to portioning the tongue though gross), how much longer until i introduce another meat type?

Thanks guys you've been a huge help!

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby FransterDoo » Wed Dec 22, 2010 2:21 pm

sounds like now is a good time to start!

What organs do you have available?

Also, depending on the size I probably wouldn't try to butcher the tongues. They are fairly tough.

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby starrlamia » Wed Dec 22, 2010 8:56 pm

FransterDoo wrote:sounds like now is a good time to start!

What organs do you have available?

Also, depending on the size I probably wouldn't try to butcher the tongues. They are fairly tough.

ummm, i can get chicken and beef liver i think, I know there is some at the grocery store i just dont remember

And of course less then an hour after I posted this we had a bile puke, just a small one though lol

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby FransterDoo » Wed Dec 22, 2010 9:24 pm

Chicken liver might be easier to start with since you can give them each 1/2 of one to start.

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby starrlamia » Wed Dec 22, 2010 10:12 pm

cool i will pick up some tomorrow... later i may take pictures to show you what 5kg of pig tongues look like lol

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby FBODGRL » Wed Dec 22, 2010 11:03 pm

I'm pretty sure I couldn't deal with tongue. Although I am surprised with the amount of meat I have handled and cut up lol

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby starrlamia » Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:35 am

gah grendel threw up tonight, not sure why. Thankfully he is pooping fine so I am not too worried, hopefully it's a one off and he just didnt feel to good today, or the pork bone i gave him didnt agree.

The hocks I got are huge! Im talkin close to 2lbs, so I ended up cutting them into pieces, I took all of the meat off and kept the bones to give as treats. Ive been pairing the hock meat up with tail pieces, they have quite a bit of fat on them but the tails actually have some meat too.
I havent started on the tongues yet lol, I ran out of ziplock bags.

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby Cindersmommy » Mon Jan 03, 2011 1:14 pm

I'm sorry if this has already been addressed but I did a search and couldn't find it. I don't have my own computer so my computer time is limited. I have read where Pacific Salmon and Jack Mackrel are not good for your dog raw but is canned salmon and mackrel OK ? Thanks in advance for any help anyone can give me.

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby starrlamia » Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:59 pm

the kids have been on raw for a few weeks and are doing great with organ meat! They've been getting turkey but we will start adding in pork soon.

The best part is we thought grendel had demodex again and he has been on ivermectin again for a while but just in the last week or so his hair has started growing back in and Im starting to think it may have been food allergy issues (the skin scrape was negative but since he had demodex before they figured they would play it safe and put him back on).
He looks great and his skin/hair overall is less dry and itchy

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Re: B.A.R.F. 101

Postby starrlamia » Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:23 pm

roflmao
I found out grendel doesnt like raw kidney
he thinks they are slimey and gross.
I gave him some in various sizes to see if he would eat it and he spit it out and made a face everytime lol
it was pretty adorable.
I froze the rest so hopefully he will eat it that way.


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