I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets!

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I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets!

Postby rubyandstewiesmom » Fri Feb 24, 2012 1:41 am

After this week I have lost all faith in the local vets. Time to go back to my dad's farm vet again. *sigh* Do you guys ever feel like vets think you are helpless and can't take care of your pets yourself?

I was switch Stewie's food...not totally switching...just more kibble and less of the Honest Kitchen so it would be easier to travel. He showed some signs of diarrhea...so I immediately stopped any change and left his food right where it was. This was on Sunday.
By Monday morning it was awful so I took him into the Emergency Vet at 6am. I said I thought at first it was the food...but I didn't think so anymore. They did a few tests, bloodwork, etc...I had brought in a stool sample but they didn't test it. Told me to keep him off of fluids ad food for 12 hours and then slowly re-introduce. He threw up just a tiny bit at the vets.
By Monday afternoon the symptoms had gotten worse, he had lost bowel control and was leaking badly. He had the chills and was shivering....so I put him in our heated garage with a load of blankets and hung out there with him. I took him into the vet at 5pm and they said that the way he was defecating and squatting he must be passing something sharp or uncomfortable and that not to worry because most likely it would pass and they gave him a mild pain med and his temperature was only up a little. To keep him off fluids and food.
I didn't feel good about this...so when we went home I called my brother and father who are both farmers a few hours from here...and they called their vet for me explaining everything. The vet called me back.
He asked me if Stewie's stool was foul smelling and I told him it was...so bad it was smelling up the entire house and it was leaking all over. He also had started vomitting as well.
I explained other symptoms and he immediately told me he thought it might be Parvo and to get him on antibiotics asap. I sent hubs to the local farm store for syringes and penicillin and immediately gave him some and right away (only about 10 hours later) he was SOOOO much improved. I'm glad I didn't trusts the vets and crammed 2 bottles of pedialyte down his throat!
I knew something was wrong...I suggested a virus...they don't want to give out antibiotics which I think is ridiculous....growing up on a farm the farm vets TRUSTED us...I always felt proactive in my dog's care. Just because Stewie was RELIGIOUSLY vaccinated, doesn't mean he couldn't get parvo. I could have lost him b/c they wouldn't test his stool. I could have lost him because they wouldn't dole out meds. I'm hate this. I will never go to another local vet again...my dogs will only be going to my dad's farm vet because he trusts me. And I trust him in return.
Do any of your farmgirls and boys feel the same way? Were you used to administering fluids, giving shots etc...and now you feel helpless? No more. Never again.

He's finally eating a bit, and drinking super well. He has a bit of blood left from inflammation and irritation to his colon and intestines and is walking a bit funny from all the straining and pooping...but he's a much happier boy sleeping in bed with mommy and daddy again! :)

I don't hate vets...just ones that think dog owners aren't as competent as they could be. With fluids and penicillin it was ALL it took to help Stewie make a super fast turnaround.

Is this scare of Parvo that it is SO difficult to treat because vets aren't being aggressive enough with it? Are they afraid to really treat an animal and push the animals healing abilities? I am so irritated.
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby rubyandstewiesmom » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:33 am

*And I should add...no proof it was parvo...I used that term too loosely. Should have said virus or bacterial infection. Sorry...in my grumpy mood I am a poor author!
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby Curly_07 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 3:09 am

I'm a farm girl, and its taken me 10 yrs to find a "city" vet I actually like. The vet you saw should have taken a sample and tested it if they wouldn't take the one you brought in. I grew up administering shots and meds to livestock, horses, dogs, cats, hogs, etc. I've been looked at like I'm crazy or something for recommending something or just asking to do things myself when seeing/calling a city vet. Why pay them administering fees when I can do it just as well? I understand they don't know me/us, but they shouldn't assume everyone is a dumb nuts.

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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby buckaroo » Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:29 am

Penicillin for Parvo makes no sense. It might help a secondary bacterial infection but it isn't going to touch Parvo at all. Also, there doesn't seem to be any conclusive proof that your dog had Parvo...

Glad he's feeling better.
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby Misskiwi67 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:53 am

Your dog had antibiotic responsive gastroenteritis, not parvo.

If he'd come to my clinic, I would have recommended hospitalizing him on IV Fluids and antibiotics for 24 hours. Dogs that vomit can't keep their medications down, and get better much faster with IV fluids (generally 24 hours instead of 48-72). I may or may not have done a giardia test or a fecal gram stain, but neither would have used the sample you brought in. I don't do fecal flotations on dogs with diarrhea, I just deworm them if their history is suspicious. Diarrhea feces is too diluted to make the test worth your money, and won't change what I do anyway.

This probably would have cost you somewhere between $400-$700, depending on if he continued to vomit and act like he might need x-rays to look for a foreign body.

Did you decline any testing or treatments? It seems very odd to me that an emergency vet would send home a dog so obviously sick, particularly one that vomited in the exam room. We generally lean towards overkill because we are the ones that see the rare cases that go bad (like dogs that go into shock from the same thing your dog had).

The vet that gave your dog antibiotics without seeing the dog first, that was illegal. I can't even count the number of dogs I've seen who's owners made their dog worse instead of better, and I never recommend a treatment without seeing the pet first, sometimes what is happening is completely different than what is described by an owner.

The reason vets don't like to let people treat their own pets is because I see more people do it wrong than people who do it right. Go back to the threads about people who drive you crazy, and imagine THOSE people treating their dogs at home. Those are the majority, sadly. And with my livelihood on the line (yes, I could lose my license to practice medicine) if I tell you to do something you haven't been trained to do, I am not going to let you do it.
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby rubyandstewiesmom » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:41 pm

I just got back from our farm vet, it was worth the drive. It is in FACT Giardia. Which what in the heck...I had NO idea I should be vaccinating against it??? I am even more irritated now because I SPECIFICALLY asked my vet at Ruby's appointment a few years ago that because we have a cabin in Northern Wisconsin if I should be getting any additional vaccinations. She said NO! I swear this is awful. And the fact that you just suggested Giardia. Oy. So Now I'm worried about Ruby!
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby rubyandstewiesmom » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:44 pm

Misskiwi67 wrote:Your dog had antibiotic responsive gastroenteritis, not parvo.

If he'd come to my clinic, I would have recommended hospitalizing him on IV Fluids and antibiotics for 24 hours. Dogs that vomit can't keep their medications down, and get better much faster with IV fluids (generally 24 hours instead of 48-72). I may or may not have done a giardia test or a fecal gram stain, but neither would have used the sample you brought in. I don't do fecal flotations on dogs with diarrhea, I just deworm them if their history is suspicious. Diarrhea feces is too diluted to make the test worth your money, and won't change what I do anyway.

This probably would have cost you somewhere between $400-$700, depending on if he continued to vomit and act like he might need x-rays to look for a foreign body.

Did you decline any testing or treatments? It seems very odd to me that an emergency vet would send home a dog so obviously sick, particularly one that vomited in the exam room. We generally lean towards overkill because we are the ones that see the rare cases that go bad (like dogs that go into shock from the same thing your dog had).

The vet that gave your dog antibiotics without seeing the dog first, that was illegal. I can't even count the number of dogs I've seen who's owners made their dog worse instead of better, and I never recommend a treatment without seeing the pet first, sometimes what is happening is completely different than what is described by an owner.

The reason vets don't like to let people treat their own pets is because I see more people do it wrong than people who do it right. Go back to the threads about people who drive you crazy, and imagine THOSE people treating their dogs at home. Those are the majority, sadly. And with my livelihood on the line (yes, I could lose my license to practice medicine) if I tell you to do something you haven't been trained to do, I am not going to let you do it.



You hit it! Giardia! And the vet did not prescribe. Only tell us correct dose! :) Pretty common with our farm vets I've been in contac with. I also bought some probiotic for him today as well. He is imporoving super fast!
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby rubyandstewiesmom » Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:47 pm

Misskiwi67 wrote:Your dog had antibiotic responsive gastroenteritis, not parvo.

If he'd come to my clinic, I would have recommended hospitalizing him on IV Fluids and antibiotics for 24 hours. Dogs that vomit can't keep their medications down, and get better much faster with IV fluids (generally 24 hours instead of 48-72). I may or may not have done a giardia test or a fecal gram stain, but neither would have used the sample you brought in. I don't do fecal flotations on dogs with diarrhea, I just deworm them if their history is suspicious. Diarrhea feces is too diluted to make the test worth your money, and won't change what I do anyway.

This probably would have cost you somewhere between $400-$700, depending on if he continued to vomit and act like he might need x-rays to look for a foreign body.

Did you decline any testing or treatments? It seems very odd to me that an emergency vet would send home a dog so obviously sick, particularly one that vomited in the exam room. We generally lean towards overkill because we are the ones that see the rare cases that go bad (like dogs that go into shock from the same thing your dog had).

The vet that gave your dog antibiotics without seeing the dog first, that was illegal. I can't even count the number of dogs I've seen who's owners made their dog worse instead of better, and I never recommend a treatment without seeing the pet first, sometimes what is happening is completely different than what is described by an owner.

The reason vets don't like to let people treat their own pets is because I see more people do it wrong than people who do it right. Go back to the threads about people who drive you crazy, and imagine THOSE people treating their dogs at home. Those are the majority, sadly. And with my livelihood on the line (yes, I could lose my license to practice medicine) if I tell you to do something you haven't been trained to do, I am not going to let you do it.


And no...I did not decline any tests. Fecal smear was done by our farm vet and was highly contaminated with Giardia...I just purchased the penicillin at our farm store and administered it myself. He was also given SubQ fluids before we left today too.
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby AllisonPitbullLvr » Fri Feb 24, 2012 3:17 pm

The giardia vaccine doesn't prevent them from getting it, it just helps reduce the chances of him infecting his environment.

Also, penicillin isn't a treatment for giardia as far as I know. Panacur or in some cases Metonidazole is.
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby Misskiwi67 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:27 pm

rubyandstewiesmom wrote:You hit it! Giardia! And the vet did not prescribe. Only tell us correct dose! :) Pretty common with our farm vets I've been in contac with. I also bought some probiotic for him today as well. He is imporoving super fast!


Um... the reason I will not tell anyone doses online is because that IS prescribing, and it is illegal without a client patient relationship (ie, an office visit and physical exam). He doesn't have to sell you the medication, only tell you what and how to administer it.

Penicillin does absolutely nothing for the giardia. I'm pretty sure the latest AAHA vaccine guidelines do NOT recommend the giardia vaccine, its basically worthless.
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby Misskiwi67 » Fri Feb 24, 2012 4:36 pm

Sorry for the double post - the previous AAHA vaccine guidelines did not recommend the giardia vaccine, and neither does the companion animal parasite council.

The 2011 vaccine guidelines make no mention of the giardia vaccine, so I think they don't even make it anymore.

Also, gastroenteritis and giardiasis are different :D I'm glad you thought I'm that good though... and even happier to hear your dog is on the mend.

Now its time to get proper treatment for the giardia for both dogs, and decontaminate your yard too.
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby Murfins » Fri Feb 24, 2012 8:50 pm

:goodpost: Completely agree, the giardia vaccine is not even effective and most vets don't use it.
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Re: I almost lost my Stewie!!!!!!!! Food Change? Parvo? Vets

Postby Shearaha1 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:19 pm

The Giardia vaccine nearly killed one of my cats. First visit to a new vet a few years ago and they popped my cats with vaccines before I could even ask what they were giving. Kearith nearly ended up in emergency. I was just lucky that I was in VT school at the time and knew how to recognize and deal with anaphalictic shock. I'm also paranoid and have an extensive pet emergency kit.
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