Thyroid fun for everyone.

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Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby heartbullies » Tue Jun 25, 2013 9:37 pm

I'm hoping Booker is hypothyroid.

He's gotten some new quirky fears that are really heartbreaking for me. In just the last 2-3 months he decided one hallway was scary. I figured it was slippery hardwood floors + a heat register on the floor, so I put down a doormat, and more recently, a no-slip carpet. He now finds the hallway nearly impassable. I've been doing some training sessions with loads of treats but the effects are short lived. Then last week he decided the hallway near my bathroom was scary; he scrunches down and scuttles through, which makes him more likely to slip/scrabble, and when that happens, it's scary. Today he got weird in the kitchen, of all places. He loves the kitchen! Now there's a spot by one cabinet that he's afraid to walk on. This literally happened since I brought him home from work today til now. Sigh.

He isn't fat and doesn't have a dull coat, minimal flaking except for a flakey tail. He got pustules on his tail last month along with some hair loss, and was treated with cephalexin for stud tail. Now it's just smooth and bald in a growing patch. It's not itchy or red. He has the return of cysts/pustules on his feet after over a year of their absence. He's been somewhat more lethargic lately at work, though mostly at home he tries to stay in bed to avoid having to walk through the hall. :( Seeing him afraid to move freely in our home makes me want to cry. His little face peering down the hallway trying to muster himself up to come down the hall to me, wagging his tail low and fast with his ears back and down... sob. It's awful.

So tomorrow we're getting blood & urine samples and submitting it for a senior screen w/free T4 add-on. I guess if that seems off then I will get another Idexx test (I get a discount that makes it about the same price as UMichigan, and WAY less than hemopet) for more specifics. If it's better to just shell out for a Hemopet one, then I will. Not sure if you guys have any feedback on that... ? He had the Wellness panel bloodwork in October, pre-op labs in February and in April tested HW, Lyme, & Erlichia negativem

Anyway, the Soloxine (sp?) is like $10/month and apparently works quickly. Hence, I'm hoping it's a thyroid problem and not something else like cognitive deterioration. I have mats & carpets and he's still suddenly scared, so I don't think the primary cause is orthopedic pain, plus he runs around on the polished concrete floors at work just fine. He's about 8, eats a grain-free low-glycemic-index diet, is on salmon oil, coconut oil, & Glyco-Flex 3.

Anyway. Any feedback or ideas are very welcome. It seems like dogs with hypothroid issues still can live a normal life span if caught early enough & consistently treated?

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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby dogs4jen » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:43 pm

I think you need the t5 for thyroid behavior related stuff. I hope you can find out what's going on with him. :hug:
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby BabyReba » Tue Jun 25, 2013 10:48 pm

Ugh. I can relate. But can hardly muster enough sane words to post. Also hoping for thyroid to answer some Button issues. Thyroid is so so complicated, and when I think about the fact that it can cause super panic attacks in humans, it boggles my mind to think how it impacts dogs.
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby Ashley&Fletcher » Tue Jun 25, 2013 11:46 pm

If it winds up being an issue with certain flooring, try these

http://www.toegrips.com/

They look hokey, but they work!
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby heartbullies » Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:55 am

I've never seen those before! I will definitely keep them in mind. He *has gotten more likely to slip as he's gotten older but it never freaked him out or scared him before. At work he still voluntarily zooms & plays some days on the slick polished/sealed concrete floors. We'll see, hopefully this week or early next week, what the results are & what the next step will be. T5- I'll look it up on the Idexx site tomorrow to see what it includes.

And I will be showing the site for the toenail grips to a friend of mine whose older dog has bad hip dysplasia and isn't very stable.

Yeah. It's really hard to see. Poor Button & poor you. :( My boyfriend just went into the kitchen & got out a bag of treats- normally B follows him into the kitchen EVERY time, hoping for a treat- and B stood a couple feet away softly whining but unwilling/able to enter. So very sad. Don't worry, Booker got fed treats in the "non-scary" room.
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby Red » Wed Jun 26, 2013 1:52 am

heartbullies wrote: If it's better to just shell out for a Hemopet one, then I will. Not sure if you guys have any feedback on that... ?


I do. If I think that clients need to check thyroid levels for behavior issues, I usually insist that they get their vets to send a blood sample to Hemopet and run more complete thyroid profiles than what would be done as average by a regular lab. I got to read several results (they send an email with the results to Dr. and owner) and recommendations. The clients whose dogs required medications for thyroid related issues were able to get a individualized plan to help the dogs, either from Dr. Dodds or a Dr. of her staff . I saw some pretty good outcomes, after the right medications were used.
I have a very recent email myself (18th of June) , for my foster dog. Mild hair loss on cheeks , less confidence than I'd like to see in certain circumstances, so I had blood sent to Hemopet, just to make sure I covered it all. Dr. Andrew Zuckerman reviewed the results.You are welcome to see the email and what was checked if you'd like, just let me know where to send it. We did a T5 PLUS ( T4, free T4, T3, free T3, TgAA - PLUS CBC, Differential, Chemistries).

heartbullies wrote: It seems like dogs with hypothroid issues still can live a normal life span if caught early enough & consistently treated?


Generally speaking, he clinical signs that are more obvious to most people are seen when a certain percentage of the thyroid gland has already been damaged by autoimmune-generated destruction.It is a process than takes time, nothing that happens within a month or two. But even then, putting dogs that have been dealing with thyroid dysfunction for a while on drugs (usually thyroxine) has been highly beneficial. I have seen improvements on dogs that were older, and those dogs probably suffered from what they were diagnosed with for a long time.
I'd really suggest that you send blood to Hemopet and do a T5 PLUS, and go from there.
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby julie64 » Wed Jun 26, 2013 4:30 am

Anyway, the Soloxine (sp?) is like $10/month and apparently works quickly.


For most dogs, yes. It took Buddy a couple of months before his body accepted it. He was eating non-stop all day and still got way too skinny. For about 5 months he seemed to do fine and then we were back, sleeping, eating a lot, weight loss. Another blood test showed he was low again, upped his dosage. (Knocking on wood) He has done well on the upped dosage.
Buddy was so good about going to the vet, but with the blood draws, then sent to the cardiologist, now he cries the whole time we are there, even with his bag of treats.

Good thoughts coming for you.
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby heartbullies » Wed Jun 26, 2013 12:01 pm

The Hemopet Plus includes a lot of duplicate labs so I'll have to figure out which one best fits for us. Anyway today we're about to head to work and I'll get his samples for the Senior Screen & Free T4 tests. Included are:

Comprehensive CBC, T4, urinalysis, anion gap, CK, GGT, TCO2 (bicarbonate), alkaline phosphatase, ALT, BUN, plus the Free T4

I should have the lab results back either Saturday or Monday. This morning he came to breakfast with us and got some yummy stuff. :) I really hope this gets figured out ASAP. I can't imagine waiting to test until he's fat & has bigger bald areas & is lethargic, because seeing him so worried/hesitant is really hard on everyone.

Good to know that it may take a while to get the medication right. If Booker ends up like Buddy at least I'll know that a good outcome is possible! Thank you all for the info & well-wishes.
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby Nickdawg » Wed Jun 26, 2013 1:47 pm

thinking of you and sweet Booker :hug:
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby El_EmDubya » Wed Jun 26, 2013 9:04 pm

I'd also read up on Iodine and switch to a fish based diet to see if that helps. (Kelp is also a supplement for iodine issues.)
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby heartbullies » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:09 am

Thank you! He eats a fish-based diet already but it does have some chicken & beef in it since he gets treats at work. ;)

I got the fax this AM but haven't talked about it with the vet yet. His Free T4 ng/dL was 1.0 and the Free T4 pmol/L was 12.9. These were within the Idexx range though on the low side of normal.

More worrisome, some of his other lab results were actually out of "normal" range. Others were at the low or high ends of normal. I have previous bloodwork from October so I can compare these at least. His GGT was 2 (normal 0-14), BUN 26 (normal 7-27), Creatinine 1.4 (normal 0.4 - 1.8), Cholesterol 294, chloride was 116 (just above normal range).

T4 was 1.5.

His WBC was 6.7 which was on the lower side, and his RBC was also on the low side, 5.69. Reticulocyte (?) low at 17. Neutrophil Seg low at 58 & outside the range. Lymphocytes high, 32.5.

The neutrophil, lymphocyte, monocyte, eosinophil, & basophil all were on the lower side of normal.

Negative glucose in his urine.

Sigh.
I was hoping for all-normal everything.

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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby HappyPuppy » Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:04 pm

...just sharing some love for you guys...
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby heartbullies » Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:41 pm

Thank you!

The vet at work didn't think anything was too alarming. I will get another blood sample and send it to HemoPet for the regular T5. It's $85 + shipping. Plus we'll see what his regular vet thinks.

I'm also going to make some no-slip house socks for him to see if that'll help. He mostly slips because he gets scared and scrabbles while rushing to run past the places he is now suddenly afraid of (?) but having better footing can't hurt. I'm using silicone bathtub caulk spiraled all around (since the socks/booties always tend to rotate on his feet) on some kid socks, and a Velcro zip-tie band at the top so they don't slip off. $6 trial run before I shell out for the toenail grippers or dog-specific booties.

Ah. I love Booker soooo much. He is a Good Dog, just high-maintenance. Right now I want him to feel happy and comfortable again! Thank you all for the info and well-wishes!

Here is the Mister Man himself, lounging in the heatwave next to a cool old dog bench, yesterday. :)
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby Nickdawg » Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:59 pm

:inlove: :inlove: :inlove:
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Re: Thyroid fun for everyone.

Postby El_EmDubya » Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:36 am

Hmmm...I'm thinking two things:
Liver/Spleen issues - you could try giving him liver as a supplement which will help with the RBC, vit A (nerves), and metal cofactors. The liver and thyroid are very connected...

or -
Go Ketogenic 70% calories from fat, ZERO carb, to work on the emotional stuff, first. The brain gets more oxygen on a ketogenic diet, which is why autistic children do so well. They get over stimulated, like animals, and fall into fight/flight response much more quickly than we "normals" do.

It takes ~30 hours for the body to move from processing glucose to fats, so expect some lethargy/whines around that point, if you choose to try it. And he'll drink much more water in the morning, so watch the water bowl.

:hug:

LMW
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